What is a common thing or trope that always seem to happen?

I would also say that I'm not sure that the "Japan Superpower" examples I see around here don't count as screws because they usually go the route of

"Regardless of POD and accumulated divergences, especially those that DIRECTLY affect Japan...

...NONE OF THAT MATTER, because anyway they will become 'Asian Nazis' and start wars of expansionist, genocidal and imperialist aggression...

...only to 'receive a reality check' and 'be put in their place' through crimes massive war crimes, perpetrated by a North American or European power."
 
Edited: I think Aluma, a better word would be a better world or scenario than just utopia but it isn’t wrong of thinking about world
I said "more utopic"(because the word utopi-ish isnt a thing unfortunately) because I meanr a better world but not a outright utopia/perfect world so yeah
I’m going to be honest Utopians, even enough is a lot more underrated is still to me, too ASB to my taste. If I ever try to have a timeline that activated, it’s going to be a mix between the two because life is beautiful, but ALs had a dark side
I think that "dark side" is too taken for granted because of the disaster that was OTL
Our world is a nightmare because of many decisions that didnt need to be
 
I said "more utopic"(because the word utopi-ish isnt a thing unfortunately) because I meanr a better world but not a outright utopia/perfect world so yeah

I think that "dark side" is too taken for granted because of the disaster that was OTL
Our world is a nightmare because of many decisions that didnt need to be
Also many people seems too bent in the thought "of course we have dark side, we need balance in the world" even if they UNBALANCE the world adding too much distopic decisions
 
Also many people seems too bent in the thought "of course we have dark side, we need balance in the world" even if they UNBALANCE the world adding too much distopic decisions
Somewhat related to this that I've seen in a few TLs, thankfully less with time because it seems to be a dying trope, where many authors seem afraid of making the protagonist nation too powerful so the rival nation gets a boost in some way to make them stronger or "A New Challenger Approaches" situation where a new realm appears to be the new threat in order to balanace the main nation
 
I would also say that I'm not sure that the "Japan Superpower" examples I see around here don't count as screws because they usually go the route of

"Regardless of POD and accumulated divergences, especially those that DIRECTLY affect Japan...

...NONE OF THAT MATTER, because anyway they will become 'Asian Nazis' and start wars of expansionist, genocidal and imperialist aggression...

...only to 'receive a reality check' and 'be put in their place' through crimes massive war crimes, perpetrated by a North American or European power."
I'm not trying to defend the trope, and I do think that having Japan's democracy from the early 20th century survive would be interesting, but the only way OTL's Japan could have been defeated is if their warmaking capacity was destroyed, which would require massive strategic bombing. Same thing with Nazi Germany. It's not really a war crime if it's legitimately destroying their warmakign capacity, which the allied strategic bombing campaigns did to both Germany and Japan. And quite honestly, both Germany and Japan were beyond horrific in WW2, with both inflicting unimaginably worse horrors on their enemies than those inflicted on them by the bombing campaigns (especially Germany, which was the single most evil state to ever exist by far). And the Axis were the ones who deliberately targeted civilians with their bombs in the first place.
 
Somewhat related to this that I've seen in a few TLs, thankfully less with time because it seems to be a dying trope, where many authors seem afraid of making the protagonist nation too powerful so the rival nation gets a boost in some way to make them stronger or "A New Challenger Approaches" situation where a new realm appears to be the new threat in order to balanace the main nation
Well, sometimes it can happen that the author makes the powerful nation too powerful but still manages to screw it up by making one of the following decisions:

[*]You have outlived your usefulness:

So our beloved Protagonist Country has finally achieved its goal: to impose its dominance over the world with the help of its Good Allies. The world is heading towards a new age of peace under the benevolent leadership of Alt-NATO, and now all the problems that remain to be solved are climatic and economic in nature, right?

MISTAKE! The Protagonist Country has reached such a level of power that, in fact, it could survive without its Good Allies. What's more, the leaders of the Protagonist Country think, why do we continue to allow these imbeciles to continue existing?! We don't need them at all anymore!

So the Protagonist Country decides out of nowhere that it is going to do everything possible to antagonize and harass its Good Allies in every way it can think of, with the idea of attacking and destroying them when they do something (in response to provocations). of the Protagonist Country) that can be sold as a Casus Belli.

This is done mainly because the author needed a conflict to continue writing, but it's usually a development that comes out of nowhere.

Of course, the entire story is written in such a way that it seeks to convince the reader that the Protagonist Country is the victim of some conceited and ungrateful "allies" who believe themselves to be more important than they really are, and who must be "put in their place."

This is despite the fact that what we see is the Protagonist Country being unreasonably insulting and demanding, treating its "allies" as if they were nothing more than stupid vassals who must obey without question and whose needs can be and are in fact ignored systematically by the Protagonist Country.

[*]Everyone must submit to me.

A variant of the previous one in which the Protagonist Country decides that, since they already dominate the world de facto, it makes no sense for neutral countries to continue to exist. So this is when the Protagonist Country develops a sudden interest in deploying "freedom of navigation missions" that involve warships invading other countries' territorial waters, causing collisions with civilian shipping in the area, and repeatedly ignoring requests. that they withdraw.

Or suddenly their air patrols are dedicated to violating the airspace of neutral nations, while the Protagonist Country's army feels a sudden appetite to carry out massive military maneuvers along the border with neutral nations, including the deployment of live fire. The Foreign Office suddenly begins instructing its ambassadors and diplomatic staff in the neutral nation to behave in the most insulting manner possible...

In short, the objective is the same as the previous one: for the Protagonist Country to obtain something that can be sold as a Casus Belli to mendaciously pretend to be the aggrieved party and be able to totally destroy the poor neutral country.
 
I'm not trying to defend the trope, and I do think that having Japan's democracy from the early 20th century survive would be interesting, but the only way OTL's Japan could have been defeated is if their warmaking capacity was destroyed, which would require massive strategic bombing. Same thing with Nazi Germany. It's not really a war crime if it's legitimately destroying their warmakign capacity, which the allied strategic bombing campaigns did to both Germany and Japan. And quite honestly, both Germany and Japan were beyond horrific in WW2, with both inflicting unimaginably worse horrors on their enemies than those inflicted on them by the bombing campaigns (especially Germany, which was the single most evil state to ever exist by far). And the Axis were the ones who deliberately targeted civilians with their bombs in the first place.
Yeah, I agree about the evilness of OTL Imperial Japan...

But the point I wanted to criticize there is precisely that deterministic idea that Japan would have become OTL Japan with indifference to what happens around it or even within the country itself. Remember I was describing ATL's Japan, not OTL's.

Basically, I'm sick of seeing instances of ATL Japan retaining its democracy, surviving, thriving, avoiding becoming its OTL WWII incarnation... only for the author to suddenly have them throw all of that away and from one day to the next become "Imperial Japan with modern weapons" even if there is no reason for them to do so, and many reasons for NOT to do so.

And, of course, always according to the author of the ATL, the only way to contain this even more bestial version of Imperial Japan apparently is to do things like deploy chemical and bacteriological weapons that eradicate the population of entire cities, use nuclear weapons as substitutes for strategic bombing, doing all this even if this imitation version of Imperial Japan lacks nuclear weapons...

...and generally behaving in such a way that it is very difficult to know whether the goal of the ATL "Allies" is to contain ATL "Imperial Japan" or exterminate the Japanese as a people.

For claryfing I'm talking about conflicts different to OTL WW2
 
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Yeah, I agree about the evilness of OTL Imperial Japan...

But the point I wanted to criticize there is precisely that deterministic idea that Japan would have become OTL Japan with indifference to what happens around it or even within the country itself. Remember I was describing ATL's Japan, not OTL's.

Basically, I'm sick of seeing instances of ATL Japan retaining its democracy, surviving, thriving, avoiding becoming its OTL WWII incarnation... only for the author to suddenly have them throw all of that away and from one day to the next become "Imperial Japan with modern weapons" even if there is no reason for them to do so, and many reasons for NOT to do so.

And, of course, always according to the author of the ATL, the only way to contain this even more bestial version of Imperial Japan apparently is to do things like deploy chemical and bacteriological weapons that eradicate the population of entire cities, use nuclear weapons as substitutes for strategic bombing, doing all this even if this imitation version of Imperial Japan lacks nuclear weapons...

...and generally behaving in such a way that it is very difficult to know whether the goal of the ATL "Allies" is to contain ATL "Imperial Japan" or exterminate the Japanese as a people.

For claryfing I'm talking about conflicts different to OTL WW2
Yeah, that's stupid. Frankly, I'm unsure whether Japan would have gone on their conquest spree had the Weimar Republic survived and not distracted Europe, let alone a PoD before that.
 
A PoD before about 1860 and you might not even have a Meiji Restoration, or if you do, it might take a different form.
Exactly. What if the Tokugawa Shogunate modernized? It was starting to reform in that direction in OTL.
Exactly. God, you don't even need to make changes outside of Japan: the world could still be OTL except for what is altered by the different decisions made by ATL Japan.
Exactly, although by the 1930s I don't think there's any way within Japan to stop the army from going on a rampage. If I remember correctly the IJA had basically gone rogue by that point.
 
Exactly. What if the Tokugawa Shogunate modernized? It was starting to reform in that direction in OTL.

Exactly, although by the 1930s I don't think there's any way within Japan to stop the army from going on a rampage. If I remember correctly the IJA had basically gone rogue by that point.
That is why the times I have tried to reform Japan I did so from previous points of divergence: in 1930 everything was too consolidated for it to be easy to impose a change of direction.

But that can also be exploited for the benefit of change: if by ATL 1930 the divergent position is the one that has been consolidated, it would be equally difficult to force a retreat to OTL.
 
Yeah, I agree about the evilness of OTL Imperial Japan...

But the point I wanted to criticize there is precisely that deterministic idea that Japan would have become OTL Japan with indifference to what happens around it or even within the country itself. Remember I was describing ATL's Japan, not OTL's.

Basically, I'm sick of seeing instances of ATL Japan retaining its democracy, surviving, thriving, avoiding becoming its OTL WWII incarnation... only for the author to suddenly have them throw all of that away and from one day to the next become "Imperial Japan with modern weapons" even if there is no reason for them to do so, and many reasons for NOT to do so.

And, of course, always according to the author of the ATL, the only way to contain this even more bestial version of Imperial Japan apparently is to do things like deploy chemical and bacteriological weapons that eradicate the population of entire cities, use nuclear weapons as substitutes for strategic bombing, doing all this even if this imitation version of Imperial Japan lacks nuclear weapons...

...and generally behaving in such a way that it is very difficult to know whether the goal of the ATL "Allies" is to contain ATL "Imperial Japan" or exterminate the Japanese as a people.

For claryfing I'm talking about conflicts different to OTL WW2
Aside from some Draka-related ISOT stories I've never seen anything like you've mentioned being used indiscriminately against Japan except for Decisive Darkness and the way they got bioweapon damage there was blowback from their own bullshit strategy.
 
A PoD before about 1860 and you might not even have a Meiji Restoration, or if you do, it might take a different form.
Have Japan keep its promises about Manchuria being a shared exploitation zone between Japanese and American business interests and you almost certainly butterfly away the Pacific War.
 
Anglo-American-Japanese-France-Italy alliance vs Russia-Germany-China-Austria Hungary. Neutral Ottomans...
Sounds like a stalemate story I read somewhere which I've never been able to find ever again.... it was basically what you said but remove American involvement.... also Russia was helped by Germany and Austria with putting down their revolutionaries.
 
Have Japan keep its promises about Manchuria being a shared exploitation zone between Japanese and American business interests and you almost certainly butterfly away the Pacific War.
FDR:”The United States of America is deeply and fundamentally opposed to Japan’s militaristic adventures in Asia and plundering of China-"
Hirohito:”Yo Franklin want to come pillage China with me?"
FDR:”Chiang Kai who?"
 
FDR:”The United States of America is deeply and fundamentally opposed to Japan’s militaristic adventures in Asia and plundering of China-"
Hirohito:”Yo Franklin want to come pillage China with me?"
FDR:”Chiang Kai who?"
ITTL it wouldn't even go that far. China would be too hostile to America for the US to side against Japan.
 
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