AHC: With a POD no earlier than January 1, 1990, break the Animation Stigma

[THE KINGFISH]

The Animation Renaissance of the 1990s is often seen as a revival of the quality of Western (more specifically American) Animation after the low points of the 1970s and 1980s. Adult animation went mainstream, 3D animation was popularized, Disney became resurgent, and cable television allowed for higher-quality animated shows. Yet despite all of this, Animation in the West remains to be seen as something only enjoyable by children - and that any adults watching are neckbeard manchildren. And while adult animation does exist - it is mostly considered a joke - from the try-hard edgy Family Guy and South Park knockoffs to the overly-cynical to the point of being soulless Rick & Morty clones.

Therefore, I challenge you users to come up with a scenario - using a POD no further back then January 1, 1990 - to come up with a scenario that makes Western Animation on par in variety and quality with Japanese Anime and Manga. This means that:

• Adult animation exists, but it has more variety than just edgy Family Guy clone #89740293740293402 or cynical Rick & Morty clone #49554985498504985048. It also includes serious adult animation, such as drama, horror, action, fantasy, epic, and the like.
• Additionally, animation targeted towards young adults and teens exist - providing a middle ground between children's animation and adult animation.
• Animation is seen as legitimate of an artform as live-action movies are. It is not unusual for animated movies to win normal awards at awards shows like the Academy Awards like Best Picture or Best Director - rather than being relegated to their own separate category. Animated movies are also far more common to see at the movies.

Let's see what you guys come up with!

 

[TheFaultsofAlts]

Let me try some new angles for your POD...

• Instead of creating the Best Animated Feature category after Beauty and the Beast is nominated for Best Picture, the Academy Awards sees this as a wake-up call for all animation, not just Disney's platinum standard of the medium. As such, there would have been one animated nomination in all the esteemed awards since then. One notable example would be putting Howl's Moving Castle in the "Best Adapted Screenplay" short list.
• Most of the edgy Family Guy, Rick & Morty, and South Park clones are deemed unfit for the adult market, meaning it's those very clones that help start the YA animation demographic. Don't worry, it gets better since then.
• Theatrical animation becomes more accepted by major film studios, after the success of shorts like Luxo Jr. and Creature Comforts. As such, more than one Animaniacs short is released before a WB feature.
• Speaking of, animated shorts begin to air before any feature film, not just the family-friendly ones.
• The government cracks down on harmful Internet comments, which results in a lot more positivity on social media.
• Primetime animation becomes a success on networks outside of Fox, especially with Gargoyles airing in primetime when Disney gets into the broadcast network business. The Goliath Chronicles wouldn't be dumbed down for morning audiences.
• Shows like The Magic School Bus and Arthur are the norm for educational television nowadays, and not Dora the Explorer or Teletubbies.
• Robotech gets credit for how much it got away during the localization. As such, by 2023, the only thing that changes for an anime dub is the language in which the actors speak.

Just some considerations for your request.

 

[THE KINGFISH]

Let me try some new angles for your POD...

• Instead of creating the Best Animated Feature category after Beauty and the Beast is nominated for Best Picture, the Academy Awards sees this as a wake-up call for all animation, not just Disney's platinum standard of the medium. As such, there would have been one animated nomination in all the esteemed awards since then. One notable example would be putting Howl's Moving Castle in the "Best Adapted Screenplay" short list.

That's what I was thinking!

• Most of the edgy Family Guy, Rick & Morty, and South Park clones are deemed unfit for the adult market, meaning it's those very clones that help start the YA animation demographic. Don't worry, it gets better since then.

Perhaps more networks get into the primetime business? Maybe Hanna-Barbera's Fish Police is actually successful ITTL.

• Theatrical animation becomes more accepted by major film studios, after the success of shorts like Luxo Jr. and Creature Comforts. As such, more than one Animaniacs short is released before a WB feature.
• Speaking of, animated shorts begin to air before any feature film, not just the family-friendly ones.
• The government cracks down on harmful Internet comments, which results in a lot more positivity on social media.
• Primetime animation becomes a success on networks outside of Fox, especially with Gargoyles airing in primetime when Disney gets into the broadcast network business. The Goliath Chronicles wouldn't be dumbed down for morning audiences.
• Shows like The Magic School Bus and Arthur are the norm for educational television nowadays, and not Dora the Explorer or Teletubbies.
• Robotech gets credit for how much it got away during the localization. As such, by 2023, the only thing that changes for an anime dub is the language in which the actors speak.

Just some considerations for your request.

My suggestion is that Ralph Bakshi's original vision for his last animated film - Cool World - is actually made instead of the clumsy Roger Rabbit knockoff we got IOTL. My PODs are that Kim Basinger is never cast into the film (IIRC she played a role in it being toned down because she wanted her sick children to watch it) and Bakshi pitches the film to a different studio such as Touchstone Pictures (which had released animated projects under their name in the past like the aforementioned Roger Rabbit) or 20th Century Fox (which had The Simpsons on FOX, and also released Bakshi's previous films such as Wizards and Fire and Ice) instead of Paramount Pictures.

 

[THE KINGFISH]

The alternate Cool World - a neo-noir horror animated film - then goes on to be a trailblazer for the American adult animation industry, receiving rave reviews from critics, excellent word-of-mouth from audiences, and ultimately becomes a cult classic.

 

[TheFaultsofAlts]

That's what I was thinking!

Thanks. Do you think Howl's Moving Castle would have had a shot at the Adapted Screenplay award when it got localized?

Perhaps more networks get into the primetime business? Maybe Hanna-Barbera's Fish Police is actually successful ITTL.

Sounds good to me. After all, it was Hanna-Barbera that laid the groundwork for the animated sitcom in the first place.

My suggestion is that Ralph Bakshi's original vision for his last animated film - Cool World - is actually made instead of the clumsy Roger Rabbit knockoff we got IOTL. My PODs are that Kim Basinger is never cast into the film (IIRC she played a role in it being toned down because she wanted her sick children to watch it) and Bakshi pitches the film to a different studio such as Touchstone Pictures (which had released animated projects under their name in the past like the aforementioned Roger Rabbit) or 20th Century Fox (which had The Simpsons on FOX, and also released Bakshi's previous films such as Wizards and Fire and Ice) instead of Paramount Pictures.

The alternate Cool World - a neo-noir horror animated film - then goes on to be a trailblazer for the American adult animation industry, receiving rave reviews from critics, excellent word-of-mouth from audiences, and ultimately becomes a cult classic.

Both of those studios are better choices than Paramount, to be honest. However, while it was tough to decide which one to choose, I would go with 20th Century Fox on this.

Not only do Bakshi and Fox have a prior relationship between artist and distributor, but it would allow someone other than Disney to make an impact in the animation renaissance.

My heart says Touchstone, but my brain says 20th Century Fox.

 

[Fratsup]

I would say this is already happening, it's just that the animation is from Japan. I mean at this point you might as well ask how to make American/Western animation to survive and remain relevant because that seems to be the real reason animation is not taken seriously.

When most animation is subpar, is pushing a message, gets cancelled, and so on, there is very little reason to watch or consider American animation. It's got to the point that most people do not care that animation is struggling or are looking forward to its fall, which you know that you fucked up somewhere if that is the current situation.

 

[Aisha Clan-Clan]

You'd need to dodge the comics code somehow. 1990? So not happening. That and anything after the late 80s makes it harder because of the simpsons as a garbage template shows just copy.

 

[THE KINGFISH]

I would say this is already happening, it's just that the animation is from Japan. I mean at this point you might as well ask how to make American/Western animation to survive and remain relevant because that seems to be the real reason animation is not taken seriously.

When most animation is subpar, is pushing a message, gets cancelled, and so on, there is very little reason to watch or consider American animation. It's got to the point that most people do not care that animation is struggling or are looking forward to its fall, which you know that you fucked up somewhere if that is the current situation.

I meant Western Animation with this scenario. Have that survive and remain relevant with a POD no earlier than 1990.

 

[Fratsup]

I know, what I an saying is that we should really be asking how to keep American animation alive and relevant, because otherwise there is little in terms of breaking the animation stigma.

For starters a major problem is that animation is controlled by just a few major entertainment corporations which causes all kind of problems.

 

[THE KINGFISH]

I know, what I an saying is that we should really be asking how to keep American animation alive and relevant, because otherwise there is little in terms of breaking the animation stigma.

OK, good. So the two of us are seeing eye to eye.

For starters a major problem is that animation is controlled by just a few major entertainment corporations which causes all kind of problems.

Perhaps if the number of major media companies in 2023 was 8-10 (with some smaller companies and studios in between) instead of 5, I'm guessing that would work.

 

[Garrison]

The Animation Renaissance of the 1990s is often seen as a revival of the quality of Western (more specifically American) Animation after the low points of the 1970s and 1980s. Adult animation went mainstream, 3D animation was popularized, Disney became resurgent, and cable television allowed for higher-quality animated shows. Yet despite all of this, Animation in the West remains to be seen as something only enjoyable by children - and that any adults watching are neckbeard manchildren. And while adult animation does exist - it is mostly considered a joke - from the try-hard edgy Family Guy and South Park knockoffs to the overly-cynical to the point of being soulless Rick & Morty clones.

Why do people keep insisting on this scenario when it obviously is no longer true even if it was in the past? I mean check out your cinema listings or go check Netflix or Amazon Prime. Arcane, Vox Machina, Nimona, the Spiderverse films, Invincible, Lower Decks, any of these familiar to you? Your entire premise is utterly wrong and just rehashing tired old stereotypes.