Could the Romans have circumnavigated the southern tip of Africa?
- Thread starter Malone
- Start date
The Romans were trading with the various Indian empires. We have a number of records of the interactions and trade with India. Most notable are the various details that Pliny the Elder gives us. For the romans if they wanted to increase the trade with the Indians, and avoid paying the Persians, It would be far easier and quicker to sail through the red sea and then to India which is what they did. If they wanted more trade with India, they could try conquering or establishing client states throughout the area.
it’s sorta like saying that you can get to space if you have enough people experienced in pushing millstones around
Yes, but not in the direction you think. Had the Romans and then Byzantines set up a permanent presence in Socotra Island, they could have easily taken advantage of Indian Ocean monsoon wind currents to sail down the east coast of Africa and could have made it to the Cape of Good Hope from the East instead of west.
Given the political and military weakness of the Khoisan people at the time along with predating the Bantu migration, it'd be interesting to see a Roman legion on an expedition of taking control of the preSwahili Coastal trade end up finding and settling the Cape, which has a climate similar to the Mediterranean. From there this ATL Roman African pseudo kingdom slowly sends expeditions up the west coast of Africa while still remaining connected to the Indian Ocean trade network (which slowly gives them continued access to new tech). Eventually Romans settle the Transvasall and discover gold and diamonds, which are then used to fund more expeditions west.
Given the political and military weakness of the Khoisan people at the time along with predating the Bantu migration, it'd be interesting to see a Roman legion on an expedition of taking control of the preSwahili Coastal trade end up finding and settling the Cape, which has a climate similar to the Mediterranean. From there this ATL Roman African pseudo kingdom slowly sends expeditions up the west coast of Africa while still remaining connected to the Indian Ocean trade network (which slowly gives them continued access to new tech). Eventually Romans settle the Transvasall and discover gold and diamonds, which are then used to fund more expeditions west.
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Isnt that OTL John Wilkins?
Like wanting to launch himself into space with a chariot
aaronupright
Banned
The Roman did sail open ocean in the Indian Ocean. Those ships need to be transferred to the Med. And then used. Hell they could probably have sailed across the Atlantic.
Now explain why anyone would want to move their very expensive ships thousands of miles away, to explodearea which as far as anyone could tell was endless ocean filled with God knows what. Same reason as the Arabs didn’.
Now explain why anyone would want to move their very expensive ships thousands of miles away, to explodearea which as far as anyone could tell was endless ocean filled with God knows what. Same reason as the Arabs didn’.
You explained about how Herodot may or may not have known about that phenomenon. Okay, let´s face it, a man that writes an encyclopedia of the knowledge of the then known world AND who was in touch with the brightest minds of his age would know his stuff about geography and traveling. And he is not doubting that the the Phoenicians traveled that long...it´s the sun phenomena that makes him doubt their tale.
Something WE today know as being accurate...which makes it even more believeable therefore.
It was 150 years, and it was not that long if you consider oral history. 4 or 5 generations. It also was an official mission, not some hush-hush private initiative
And if they wanted to really remove the Parthians/Persians as a middleman, they'd focus on conquering Mesopotamia down to Charax, getting a port on the Persian Gulf. There is, as you say, no reason for them to try to circumnavigate the continent.
They don't get back- well at least not the way that they came.
Instead, the Romans make contact with Arab traders in what is now modern day Somalia- or what was modern day Somalia and is now actually modern day Puntland, Somaliland, and Al Shababville.
Anyways, conversations with the Arabs and locals confirm that the circumnavigation of Africa has brought the Roman expedition relatively close to the Roman protectorates of Egypt and Israel and the Roman satellite of Syria.
After receiving a generous tip from the Romans and also receiving threats of Roman vengeance should they not be given assistance, the Arabs agree to direct the Romans to the Red Sea and then to Egypt or Israel.
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Lusitania
Donor
Again I was talking about sailing along the west coast of African the same route the Portuguese took. There is no way a Roman ship sailing in that direction for first time makes it all the way to South Africa. The Portuguese took almost a dozen of expeditions just to get to Gold Coast. Then had to get to Angola and finally to South Africa before they realized that they could go around South Africa. That was over 60 years sailing and exploring with 15th centuries ships. The most advanced at that time. Not some ship from Mediterranean Sea.
If the information we got on Hanno was correct the Phoenicians got to Kameroon fine...