Rump Austrian Empire after World War I

[chris N]

I have decided to take another look at the Rump Austrian Empire in World War II and perhaps change some of the things.
World War I had been a disaster for Europe. The First World War had taken place and a lot of the events that had taken place in our time line had taken place in this one until 1916. The Death of the Empire's oldest serving Empire had come as a shock. He had been emperor or Kaiser for an incredibly long reign. His replacement was Kaiser Karl I a much younger man with a large family. Karl had a connection to the people of the Empire. He was well loved by his Slovenian subjects and the Croatians also felt a connection. He was a reformer and wanted to make a lot of changes to the Empire. He felt that only by making the people of all parts of the empire feel that they were part of it did he stand a chance of keeping it together.

The news from the Eastern front was not good and it just indicated that the war needed to be brought to a conclusion now before things had a chance to get worse. The Serbs had taken a beating and the allies were losing there. On the front with Italy the Slovenian General who commanded the front had received reinforcements and Germany had also deployed troops there. The result had been a massive offensive which had pushed deep enough into Italy to Knock the Italians out of the war. The Italian government had fallen and the new one called for a cease fire.
The Austrian Kaiser could already see that the independence movement was gaining hold in Bohemia and Slovakia even Hungary was not dependable. As a result the Austrians secretly met with the British and French in Spain to come up with a peace plan.
The fact was that the British could see that their Eastern Ally Russia had taken a beating and Germany was gaining the upper hand. The anti-war movement had taken root.
The Peace agreement that finally came about saw the Creation of many new states. Austria shrank and Russia also saw the lost of a lot of territory

 

[Analytical Engine]

Italy is not going to like this deal. At least, they would want the Italian-speaking bits, and Dalmatia.

However, the UK and France may just tell them to stuff it. Not sure what the US would think of it.

 

[Arkenfolm]

Those Hungarian borders are terrible, since most of those regions bordering Romania had maybe 10% - 20% Hungarians compared to the more interior Transylvanian regions which were majority Hungarian. Hungary's borders as of the Second Vienna Award, ugly as they were, are the most logical compromise between having something approximating today's Hungary-Romania border or having Hungary keep most all of its pre-Trianon borders.

Sopron/Ödenburg not being in Austria seems questionable as well. Might as well go with tradition and have Burgenland, of which Sopron was a part of, given to Hungary as it was legally part of the Kingdom of Hungary. Or you could just have a plebiscite which may or may not be rigged and Sopron joins Austria or as in OTL you get that awful Burgenland border.

I think Austria would still want access to the sea via Fiume (and suppress all the Slovenes and Croats on the way to that access), but no way Croatia isn't going to want to split. Slavs are making up the majority of the rump Austria.

Also, I can't imagine Trentino going to Austria here. I'd imagine Austria would gladly trade Trentino for Trieste, or even something approximating nowadays borders (leaving Koper/Capodistria as their main port) if they had the choice.

 

[chris N]

Since Italy was knocked out of the war the French and British could care less about what the opinion of Italy is. The Representatives of the Austrian Empire met with the French, British, Hungarians and Romanians to make the final adjustment to the borders. Hungary regained some territory but lost German populated territory to Austria . The country that was very happy with the results was the Kingdom of Greece which gained a lot of territory. The Kingdom of Serbia was now referred to as Yugoslavia with the addition of so much.
The Austrian Empire had been reduced in size quite a bit . The Croatians had decided to remain with the Austrians as they did not want to be part of a nation dominated by the Eastern Orthodox faith. They and the Slovenians had been part of the Austrian Empire for centures and were now gaining more rights in the new Empire

.

 

[NOMISYRRUC]

Does the Hungary in the above map include the parts of Slovakia it received under the Vienna Award? To me it looks as if they don't.

I'm not as knowledgeable on the subject as @metalinvader665 but I agree with him about the borders.

For this to work I think you need a World War One where the Central Powers still loose, but Austria-Hungary performs well enough to give the rumps of Austria and Hungary enough negotiating power to have a say in the awards of territory at the peace conference.

Hungary would get its Vienna Award borders. Italy would get what it did IOTL less the South Tyrol but possibly plus Dalmatia. Yugoslavia would get Croatia, but would be too busy squabbling with Italy over Dalmatia and Illyria to have time for Austria keeping Southern Styria, Carniola and Fiume.

In this situation the TTL Rump of Austria would include the German areas of Bohemia-Moravia that were adjacent to the OTL Rump of Austria. That and the loss of part of Slovakia to Hungary would make Czechoslovakia a smaller country, but it would also be a more homogenous one. It might mean Hitler wants the remainder of the Sudetenland less badly if he and the Nazis still come to power.

 

[NOMISYRRUC]

Since Italy was knocked out of the war the French and British could care less about what the opinion of Italy is.

In that case Austria should keep Illyria and Yugoslavia should be awarded the Dalmatian Islands that appear to have gone to Italy in your map.

 

[NOMISYRRUC]

Since Italy was knocked out of the war the French and British could care less about what the opinion of Italy is.

I think that argument does not work because Romania and Serbia were knocked out of the war IOTL, but they still gained a lot of territory in the peace settlement.

 

[Jürgen]

The only Way I could ser it happen are og the Setbs have alienared borg the Croats, Slovenes and Western Allies before the peace treaty. So let's sat that the croats and Slovenes create a kingdom of Croats and Slovenes, which because of fear of the Serbs push for in dynastic union with Austria. Austria accept the new dual monarchy of Austria-Slavonia to keep a coastline, the allies accept it because they're pissed at the Serbs too, so the question are what can the Serb do to alienate all these otter players?

 

[chris N]

 

[stubear1012]

I am wondering if what type of economic cooperation will be between the Austrian Empire and Czechoslovakia. It is my understanding that Czechoslovakia was the most industrialized part of the old empire. I am assuming that they would want an economic agreement with the Austrian Empire so that they can sell to their old customers and so that they can use the Empire's rail lines and seaports for trade.

Also there was a separatist movement in Bavaria after the war. It would be interesting to see if that movement grows stronger with an Austrian Empire on their borders. It is my understanding that Bavaria and the Austrian Empire are predominant Catholic. Would an independent Bavaria develop close relations with an Austrian Empire? I am sure that the French would like that. What was the joke? The French love Germany so much they wanted 5 or 6 Germanies.

 

[chris N]

Above is the final revision to the map. The New Yugoslavian state gained Macedonia which was taken from Bulgaria. The Bulgarians lost a lot of territory.

 

[chris N]

Since Kaiser Karl still rules the much smaller Austrian Empire he was able to reach agreements with the Czechoslovakian state regarding trade. Yes Bohemia and Slovakia were the regions which manufactured a lot of things used by the old Empire. Much of the Armies Artillery and all of the guns for the Navy came from that region. With much less distrust it was possible to reach agreements.

 

[Arkenfolm]

The Austrian Empire had been reduced in size quite a bit . The Croatians had decided to remain with the Austrians as they did not want to be part of a nation dominated by the Eastern Orthodox faith. They and the Slovenians had been part of the Austrian Empire for centures and were now gaining more rights in the new EmpireView attachment 314331 .

But why don't the Croats just make their own country? It isn't like their whole leadership ever at any point agreed with Yugoslavia and its tendancy of Serb domination. And here you're making a case where the Croats have a clear reason to make their own state, and the Austrians have minimal potential to resist.

What you have as a result is a Kingdom of the Serbs (i.e. Serbia and whatever Albanians, Bosniaks, and such they've managed to drag along, basically just Greater Serbia as conceived for many decades) and then the remaining Slavs. Croatia as constituted in Austria-Hungary is mostly Slav--with lots of Serbs and Hungarians in addition to the Croat majority. Dalmatia has more Italians (mostly in Fiume) as Germans. That Austria is best just named Austria-Croatia, since Croats will have just as much an influence as Hungarians did in Austria-Hungary. I suspect this will polarise everyone involved, so it probably ends similar to OTL's post-war Austria with Anschluss. Nazis could negotiate an Anschluss with the Slavic parts going to an Ustashe Croat state. Although I suppose that's the worst possible option, but pitting Austrian nationalists and Croat nationalists, with some Slovene nationalists added too, in the same state against each other can't end well.

 

[chris N]

Whether Croatia will remain in the Austrian Empire is a question that at this point I am not about to answer. I will say that by the time this is taking place Kaiser Karl I had moved to create a federated Empire. The Commander in Chief of the Austrian Imperial Army is currently a Slovenian who had served on the front fighting the Italians.

 

[Arkenfolm]

I think you're still denying Slovene national consciousness (clearly Slovenes considered themselves separate from the large German minority there) as well as Croat national consciousness which in the interwar era nearly tore Yugoslavia apart. A federated empire here might as well be called Austria-Croatia because of the influence the Slavs will have there. And Hungary is now an enemy who wants Croatia, because of access to the sea as well as Hungarian minorities in Croatian Slavonia (and Fiume!). Croatia is Hungarian territory because of the ancient claim of the Hungarian crown on Croatia.

And which Slovene is this who leads their military? Most of Austria-Hungary's top Slavic generals were Croats.

As I suggested, everything seems to stoke nationalism and fascism. Nazi Germans grab the German parts, fascist Italy grabs the Italian parts, and a fascist Yugoslavia grabs the Slavic parts. There would be opposition, but a major part of that, the Croats, would rather just make their own state than anything else.

 

[stubear1012]

Does the presence of the Austrian Empire make a difference in the Polish-Czechoslovak war over Cieszyn Silesia? It was my understanding that neither side was happy with the final settlement.

"Cieszyn Silesia or the Duchy of Teschen (Polish: Cieszyn and Czech: Těšín) was a small area in south-eastern Silesia. The last Austrian census of 1910 (determining nationality according to the main communication language (German: Umgangssprache) of the respondents) showed that it was predominantly Polish-speaking in three districts (Cieszyn, Bielsko, and Fryštát) and mainly Czech-speaking in the fourth district of Frýdek.[2] The city of Cieszyn itself was mainly German-speaking.[3] Part of the population (the Ślązakowcy) claimed a distinct, Silesian identity.[4]

The chief importance of Cieszyn Silesia was the rich coal basin around Karviná and the valuable Košice-Bohumín Railway line which linked the Czech lands with Slovakia. Furthermore, in north-western Cieszyn Silesia the railroad junction of Bohumín served as a crossroad for international transport and communications.[5][6]"

 

[NOMISYRRUC]

Although interwar Balkan politics is something I know nothing about I'm finding this very interesting.

AFAIK in Austria-Hungary Croatia was a sub-kingdom of Hungary, but Dalmatia was directly under Vienna (AFAIK because it had been part of Venice). Therefore I don't see an automatic union between Croatia and Dalmatia either as an independent state or within a Greater Austria.

What I can see is some sort five cornered war between Austria, Croatia, Italy, Serbia and Slovenia. Possibly with alliances of convenience between Italy and Serbia on one hand and Austria, Croatia and Slovenia on the other. It would be started by Italy which wants Dalmatia and the South Tyrol assisted by Serbia which wants Croatia and Slovenia. Then the Italians and Serbs fight each other over Dalmatia and Illyria.

 

[chris N]

The Austrian Empire claiming to be the legal successor to the Austro_Hungarian Empire took control of the Royal and Imperial Navy. The Austrians were well aware that the Italians had no desire for the Yugoslavs to gain any part of it. But since it was still the property of Austria the Italians believed that any attempt to attack or destroy it would only cause massive problems with the French and British. Actually Karl planned to keep the best ships in the Navy and scrap others. There was talk of salvaging the guns from the old predreadnoughts and using them in fortifications. Austrian Intelligence was well aware that there were problems in many of the Balkan countries and in fact Russia was still a mess. The Red Revolution had been put down but Czar Nichola II had died as had some of the Royal family. Grand Duke Michael was now the acting Czar but it was clear that the Provisional Government would never allow him all of the power that Nicholas had had
The Allies had wanted Kaiser Wilhelm and his son gone but had not demanded the doing away with the Monarchy. The Result had been chaos.

 

[chris N]

Italy was not at all happy with the creation of Yugoslavia. It did not like the Serbs but more than that the incorporation of Montenegro into the Kingdom left a bitter tast in the Italians. The Italians had some claim to the country as the Italian King was related to the Montenegro King. Thus there was anger and perhaps enough to go to war. Italy's defeat in the last war was unexpected and Greece had also ceased land in what had become Turkey that the Italians thought should be theres. It seemed that Kaiser Karl had friend in the British Royal family and connections to France which also made any attempt on Austria to be risky.

 

[chris N]

With Karl still on the throne it is likely that he would attempt to mediate differences between the Czechs and the Poles seeing if a compromise could be reached. Both countries would stand much to lose in a conflict.