What happens to the Austrian monarchy in a Greater German Empire?

[kreepysam]

Assuming Berlin still prides itself on its navy, I would think they'd want a port on the Mediterranean. Getting Istria (or at least Trieste) would give them one on the Adriatic.

There is also Pola, if it proves impossible to retain Trieste in the service of placating Italy.

Would Austrians accept Protestant being head of their state? They might accept being part of Germany but I have bit hard to see them accepting Protestant being head of state of Austria. Perhaps some Catholic branch of Hohenzollern if Habsburgs are not cooperative.

Would they worry so much by this time? The Lutherans accept some of the Catholic sacraments anyway too, so they're not completely different or 'alien' in practice.

 

[Nivek]

There is also Pola, if it proves impossible to retain Trieste in the service of placating Italy

You think they would care about Italy? Both are coming in

 

[America'sFuhrer]

Would Austrians accept Protestant being head of their state? They might accept being part of Germany but I have bit hard to see them accepting Protestant being head of state of Austria. Perhaps some Catholic branch of Hohenzollern if Habsburgs are not cooperative.

If a Habsburg is still the Archduke, I would say that it would be sufficient enough for the Catholics, similar to how Bavaria etc coped with being under the Hohenzollerns.

My opinion on the Bohemia situation is that it would be an autonomous Kingdom also ruled by the Archduke of Austria, which would retain the Czech/Moravian rights.

I think the Burgenland will be a real issue, as there is no real reason for it to stay under the Hungarian rule, but it will be a tense negotiation unless Germany wants to simply make a decision and make Hungary comply. Bratislava was technically German-majority, as was Sopron. An idea if the Germans are concerned enough about the remaining German diaspora would be to do some sort of population exchange in a larger Burgenland.

 

[Nivek]

If a Habsburg is still the Archduke, I would say that it would be sufficient enough for the Catholics, similar to how Bavaria etc coped with being under the Hohenzollerns.

My opinion on the Bohemia situation is that it would be an autonomous Kingdom also ruled by the Archduke of Austria, which would retain the Czech/Moravian rights.

I think the Burgenland will be a real issue, as there is no real reason for it to stay under the Hungarian rule, but it will be a tense negotiation unless Germany wants to simply make a decision and make Hungary comply. Bratislava was technically German-majority, as was Sopron. An idea if the Germans are concerned enough about the remaining German diaspora would be to do some sort of population exchange in a larger Burgenland.

I think Burgenland goes for Austria with Hungary keeping Bratislava and sopron.

 

[Typho]

Germans in Hungary such as Burgenland, metropolitan areas and Transylvania would present a large ethnic minority, which can influence the country.

If a Habsburg is still the Archduke, I would say that it would be sufficient enough for the Catholics, similar to how Bavaria etc coped with being under the Hohenzollerns.

My opinion on the Bohemia situation is that it would be an autonomous Kingdom also ruled by the Archduke of Austria, which would retain the Czech/Moravian rights.

I think the Burgenland will be a real issue, as there is no real reason for it to stay under the Hungarian rule, but it will be a tense negotiation unless Germany wants to simply make a decision and make Hungary comply. Bratislava was technically German-majority, as was Sopron. An idea if the Germans are concerned enough about the remaining German diaspora would be to do some sort of population exchange in a larger Burgenland.

Germans in Transylvania enjoyed a lot of autonomy, which is why Burgenland can be a bargaining chip, letting in stay in Hungary in exchange for protecting diaspora rights.

 

[JohnnyFive]

Would Slovenia want to join with Germany? I’ve read they and the Croats were fairly supportive of the AH Empire?

 

[Just a Turteldove Fan]

Would Slovenia want to join with Germany? I’ve read they and the Croats were fairly supportive of the AH Empire?

I mean, with all due respect to Slovenians and checks. Their opinion matters little in the grand scheme. Slovenia is vital as it grants Germany access to the Mediterranean. Bohemia is seen as core German land, and its industry would make Germany even more of a hegemon. And any armed revolt would be futile. And eventually, I think both groups will relegate themselves to peaceful coexistence, trying to get concessions out of the Germans. Maybe they demand an exception to conscription.

 

[Typho]

I mean, with all due respect to Slovenians and checks. Their opinion matters little in the grand scheme. Slovenia is vital as it grants Germany access to the Mediterranean. Bohemia is seen as core German land, and its industry would make Germany even more of a hegemon. And any armed revolt would be futile. And eventually, I think both groups will relegate themselves to peaceful coexistence, trying to get concessions out of the Germans. Maybe they demand an exception to conscription.

How big would Germany's navy interests bein the Mediterranean?

 

[Just a Turteldove Fan]

How big would Germany's navy interests bein the Mediterranean?

Like warm water, ports are to the Russians. Having a base in the Mediterranean would severely weaken Britain's strategic position. In just one swoop Germany can base its entire submarine fleet in the Mediterranean making shipping through Suez much more difficult in case of war. You force Britain to station a decent size fleet in the Mediterranean to protect the empire's trade lines. The Germans are desperate for ways to spread the British Fleet as their only chance to break a possible blockade is by making the grand fleet smaller and thus comparable to the High Seas fleet.

 

[Nivek]

Like warm water, ports are to the Russians. Having a base in the Mediterranean would severely weaken Britain's strategic position. In just one swoop Germany can base its entire submarine fleet in the Mediterranean making shipping through Suez much more difficult in case of war. You basically force Britain to station a decent size fleet in the Mediterranean to protect the empire's trade lines.

Not only that, now with the whole empire resources,old Austria could develop their experimental idea in sea plane tenders ie aircraft carriers, the salamander class.

 

[Just a Turteldove Fan]

Not only that, now with the whole empire resources,old Austria could develop their experimental idea in sea plane tenders ie aircraft carriers, the salamander class.

Oh yeah, and you also get the Austrian shipyards. Enlarging your shipbuilding capacity somewhat, even if it's still not a match for Britain's.

 

[Typho]

Like warm water, ports are to the Russians. Having a base in the Mediterranean would severely weaken Britain's strategic position. In just one swoop Germany can base its entire submarine fleet in the Mediterranean making shipping through Suez much more difficult in case of war. You force Britain to station a decent size fleet in the Mediterranean to protect the empire's trade lines. The Germans are desperate for ways to spread the British Fleet as their only chance to break a possible blockade is by making the grand fleet smaller and thus comparable to the High Seas fleet.

And the Adriatic sea isn't too much of a bottleneck?

 

[Nivek]

And the Adriatic sea isn't too much of a bottleneck?

No more than the Baltic but the thing is having a safe haven south expand massively the range of the Kaiserlich Marine.

 

[JanWellem]

Imperial Germany wasn't a unitary state, but a federal one. So if Bohemia becomes part of the German Empire a plurality of political decisions would be made in Prague, not Berlin, education chief amongst them (it still is the purview of the Bundesländer to this very day in the FRG, e.g. in the Saarland French is still the first foreign language taught in schools and Russian still an option in the eastern Bundesländer). Dividing Bohemia into a Sudeten borderland and a Czech core wasn't a topic until after an independent Czechoslovak state was formed IOTL. It wasn't all that popular among the German speaking population living in the Czech heartland - depending on the exact boundaries of the Sudetenland between 300 and 600 thousand - for it would turn them into a negligible minority, 5 - 10% - in a core Bohemia, easily deprived of their minority rights compared to a third of the total population in an undivided Bohemia.

No idea about Slovenians.

The fact that to this very day Austrian news refer to cities in Slovenia by their German names, e.g. Laibach for Ljubljana and Marburg for Maribor, speaks, I reckon, volumes.

 

[Kaiser of France]

In the classic CP victory scenario where A-H wins the war but is dissolved in the 1920s, it is likely that not only Austria itself would join Germany but also Bohemia-Moravia, which was seen at that time as an integral part of the German world. It is a good question whether or not Austria and Bohemia-Moravia would join the German Empire as separate entities (though both ruled by a Habsburg) or as one untied Habsburg kingdom. Austria's borders are also likely to include all of OTL Slovenia and perhaps Burgenland from Hungary if they acquire it through a referendum like IOTL.

Though once the Habsburgs join the German Empire, they will have to accept dropping their status as emperor, as that title goes to the Hohenzollerns. Perhaps the Habsburgs might refer to themselves as Grand Dukes, becoming the Grand Duchy of Austria within the German Empire, since that title is equal to king.

 

[Just a Turteldove Fan]

In the classic CP victory scenario where A-H wins the war but is dissolved in the 1920s, it is likely that not only Austria itself would join Germany but also Bohemia-Moravia, which was seen at that time as an integral part of the German world. It is a good question whether or not Austria and Bohemia-Moravia would join the German Empire as separate entities (though both ruled by a Habsburg) or as one untied Habsburg kingdom. Austria's borders are also likely to include all of OTL Slovenia and perhaps Burgenland from Hungary if they acquire it through a referendum like IOTL.

Though once the Habsburgs join the German Empire, they will have to accept dropping their status as emperor, as that title goes to the Hohenzollerns. Perhaps the Habsburgs might refer to themselves as Grand Dukes, becoming the Grand Duchy of Austria within the German Empire, since that title is equal to king.

I believe the new german states would be the archduchy of Austria and the Kingdom of Bohemia-Moravia both rules by Karl. Because a unified cilsasthenia would prove too influential.

 

[Nivek]

I believe the new german states would be the archduchy of Austria and the Kingdom of Bohemia-Moravia both rules by Karl. Because a unified cilsasthenia would prove too influential.

An unify cislethania would have the same power as Prussia but less votes in the Bundesrat, separate now they might tie Prussia..that will be fun

 

[Lalli]

I think that if Bohemia is separated from Austria (either as part of Germany or as independent) it might too get its own monarch. There wasn't shortage of candidates.

 

[SealTheRealDeal]

I think that if Bohemia is separated from Austria (either as part of Germany or as independent) it might too get its own monarch. There wasn't shortage of candidates.

Like the Teschen Habsburgs?

 

[Lalli]

Like the Teschen Habsburgs?

I thought some non-Habsburg family but some other Habsburg branch could work too.